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open bolt/striker trigger group ideas?
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  justin22885

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Posted: September 21 2017 at 1:21am | IP Logged Quote justin22885

does anyone have any ideas for a really simple, yet functional semi auto striker or open bolt (which can be converted to striker) trigger group that would be easy to produce?.. i thought about designing something around the uzi or sten fire control group but i cant seem to get blueprints or schematics of those to implement them in anything

any other ideas?
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  Paraquat

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Posted: September 21 2017 at 6:57am | IP Logged Quote Paraquat

The original Sten and Uzi are really simple. The bolts are spring loaded to push forwards and just held by a simple sear.
Depressing the trigger lowers the sear and as long as you're holding it down, the firearm keeps cycling.

I'm sure you're aware of this. In the conversions I've seen, everyone uses an AR trigger group.

The RPD I finished from project guns was open bolt, but the same idea was applied to the striker. It's just on a rail affixed to the bolt. The trigger drops a sear that releases the striker. Just a middle man to the bolt.

If you're looking for a picture of an Uzi trigger pack I can ask my uncle. He has a Form 4 from the 70's.
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  justin22885

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Posted: September 21 2017 at 12:00pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

unfortunately the sear on the sten stretches way too forward to be of use, the sterling FCG might be perfect, but i cant find any schematics of it to actually design anything around it.. i may have to buy a sterling FCG and backwards engineer it.. from what i can tell theyre pretty easy to convert to semi-auto only when utilizing a striker

im also open to some options that would just be easy to fabricate from scratch
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  Paraquat

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Posted: September 21 2017 at 1:25pm | IP Logged Quote Paraquat

Give me a week. I think I have a L2A3 kit stashed in my attic.
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  justin22885

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Posted: September 21 2017 at 3:13pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

alright, thanks

in the mean time im going to see what i can come up with. this is one idea of mine in which the disconnector is on the sear.. in the ready to fire position the disconnector pokes out the back of the sear where the trigger can contact it.. when the trigger is pulled it pushes up on the extended disconnector causing the sear to rotate down to release the striker.. upon doing so, it raises the nose portion of the disconnector.. when the bolt runs into that portion it cases the disconnector to retract, disengaging it from the trigger allowing the sear to pop back up into position to catch the striker again.. releasing the trigger will allow the disconnector to reset for a semi auto rate of fire


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Posted: September 23 2017 at 9:58pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

y'all know that DI action i sketched out that fits inside a 1.5" round tube?.. if i rolled the carrier 90 degrees for a side magazine, made an FG42 style bolt body that utilized the savage 10 bolt heads, used the stirling SMG fire control group, the end result would be a fairly low cost blending of the stirling SMG and the FG42 for a 5.56/7.62x39 rifle using a semi auto converted stirling trigger pack to lock the bolt carrier 1/4" from fully forward (after the bolt itself has fully locked) with the combined final travel of the carrier and the firing pin acting no different than a striker converted semi auto stirling
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  backbencher

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Posted: September 24 2017 at 9:21am | IP Logged Quote backbencher

I'm always up for a side magazine.  BATFE unjustly frowns on open bolt semi-autos, however.

OrionsHammer was fond of used AK FCGs, on the grounds they were really cheap b/c there were so many 922r take offs.  Plastic AR FCGs are available, and they can be home cast, though I would suggest sticking to other parts of the LPK rather than casting your own plastic sear.
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Posted: September 24 2017 at 10:15pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

the carrier is not the bolt, just a mechanism to lock it, the carrier is allowed to travel so long as the bolt itself is actually locked, the FG42 in semi-auto mode held the oprod about 1/4 from fully forward to work as a striker and thats all this would be doing

i was actually working on a simple little weapon that had a short-stroke gas system (literally an FAL gas system) that was mounted external of the receiver, with either a press-on rear sight block like device, or part of the trunnion to secure the rear end of an external gas tube.. gas piston itself in that design would just impact the front of a charging handle thatd work somewhat like the gas key component to a piston converted AR-15...

but if i had the sterling FCG, taking my tube-steel DI system which fits inside a tube receiver the same size the sterling used, it wouldnt be all that hard at all to make a couple tweaks and essentially make a 5.56 sterling SMG, sterling folding stock included

imagine this in 5.56 with AR-15 mags.. push button mag release would be right by your thumb in this case, so while grabbing a spare mag you could rotate your wrist while pushing the button with your thumb to drop a mag


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Posted: September 25 2017 at 8:13am | IP Logged Quote backbencher

Ah, I twig now.  That would be slick.

I may have figgered out how to build the Lyndon as a pistol - AR trigger jig, AR57 upper, and use a DPR Kalifornia compliance part to tie the jig to the buffer tube.  Less expensive than the Hera Arms thumbhole stock, as well.
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  justin22885

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Posted: September 25 2017 at 4:42pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

lyndon?
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  backbencher

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Posted: September 27 2017 at 7:33am | IP Logged Quote backbencher

Lyndon:


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  justin22885

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Posted: September 27 2017 at 1:41pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

i do not believe i have seen one of those before.. i do not think id even want one though.. if i go back to a pistol cal carbine, it wouldnt be to that or even that caliber.. id go with either the sterling or something  from scratch using a bottom feeding bolt and glock mags
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Posted: September 27 2017 at 6:48pm | IP Logged Quote backbencher

I didn't think you had - I just got the upper while I was away on hurricane duty.

Test fire is tomorrow - Hera Arms thumbhole stock, eBay AR trigger jig, AR57 upper.

Not the cheapest way to build a gun, but probably the easiest.
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Posted: September 27 2017 at 10:41pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

well, seems the stirling lower is welded on, a couple side plates making up the grip frame just gets welded on the bottom of the receiver, grip panels screw on and the trigger group pins inside it, very low cost and simple, with a welded on magazine well.. yeah, i think incorporating a sterling lower into a 1.5" round steel tube DI 5.56 upper is about the simplest one can make a functioning intermediate caliber weapon

after i can incorporate a stirling trigger pack and grip frame then i think its pretty much done.. then i can start reviewing the parts, locating materials, pricing things out, and get a prototype together.. i am currently in a semi-auto rifle unfriendly state though so i will have to make adjustments or move before constructing it though
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Posted: September 27 2017 at 10:46pm | IP Logged Quote backbencher

Actually sounds very similar to the low-cost full-auto prototype made during the Vietnam war using side loaded AR magazines.  I want to say TRW made the prototypes, which worked fine.  No one was willing to risk arming the South Vietnamese populace, however, which clearly was a risk worth taking.

The trigger jig in the picture runs less than $40 shipped on eBay, I believe.  With the relatively low cost of the AR FCS and the now wide availability of trigger jigs, would that not suit being stuffed in the bottom of your tube receiver?
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  justin22885

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Posted: September 27 2017 at 11:30pm | IP Logged Quote justin22885

you mean the TRW low maintenance rifle?.. yeah, i seen a technical diagram of one of those.. they took a lot of inspiration from the M14/garand though in having the external oprod that enclosed the whole right side of the receiver.. honestly, its a bit over-engineered if you ask me

ive had similar ideas even before being aware of the TRW, but instead of the M14 type oprod setup, id have designed the trunnion to support the full FAL gas system.. with the gas tube, piston, return spring, gas block, regulator, etc and simply have the tail of the FAL piston strike the face of a reciprocating right side charging handle.. you could also have a T shaped charging handle up top for it to strike against, with an aluminum "dust cover" over top of it containing the top rail.. this would be similar to the G36

i may still work on that idea, but im not really all that convinced its going to yield anything any simpler than a DI system in a straight 1.5" tube
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